From psychology student to thriving doula business
Interview with Jasmine Meek
Julia Jones talks with Jasmine Meek about her journey from studying psychology to discovering her calling as a postpartum doula. Jasmine shares how she sped through her training, quickly built a client base, and expanded her services to include postnatal massage and her innovative “mother’s helper” visits. Together, they explore the joys and challenges of starting a doula business, balancing family finances, and finding sustainable ways to support mothers at every stage.
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About Jasmine
Jasmine Meek is a Postpartum Doula and Mothers Helper, offering calm, capable support through the often-overlooked seasons of early motherhood. With deep empathy and practical wisdom, she helps mothers feel nurtured, validated and supported whether they are recovering from birth, navigating life with a newborn, or managing the daily juggle of toddlerhood. Based in Brisbane and the Redlands, Jasmine provides hands-on, in-home care that centres the mother, lightens the mental load, and brings a sense of steadiness to family life.
Reach out to Jasmine here: https://www.thebaysidedoula.com/
We explore the following questions:
How did you start your journey to become a postpartum doula, and what sparked your interest in this field?
What were some of the biggest challenges you faced when you first started your business, particularly with pricing and getting clients?
How have your personal and family circumstances, such as your husband losing his job, influenced the way your business has grown and evolved?
Can you tell us more about the new 'mother's helper' service you've created, and how it differs from your work with fourth-trimester clients?
What is the balance like between your intensive postpartum support and the mother's helper work?
How has your mindset around your business changed from when you first started to where you are now?
What are your future plans for the business, and do you see yourself making any other big changes?
Do you feel that your work now aligns with your original vision of doing something you love that doesn't feel like work?
What advice would you give to other doulas or small business owners about the journey of growing a business organically?
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Transcript
Julia Jones:
Hello and welcome to Newborn Mothers Podcast. Today, we are interviewing Jasmine, who is the Bayside Doula. And Jasmine, you started with me a few years ago in 2022. And you also have a background in massage and psychology. So, are you happy to take us back to the beginning of this journey and what made you interested in becoming a postpartum doula?
Jasmine Meek:
Yes, thank you so much for having me. I was always planning to be a psychologist and, studied psychology one and a half times and then didn't finish but that was a huge passion. So I think, looking back, it's the passion for supporting other human beings and emotionally supporting other human beings. So that was always there. I also always loved giving massage and receiving massage. I would say massage is my love language. My husband gets very upset by that 'cause I would happily whine for one every single night, but I don't get to. But it wasn't until after my postpartum doula training with you that I did an extra course to study postnatal massage and brought it all in, and that was fantastic.
So, yeah, I did the Newborn Mothers course in 2022. My second child was about 18 months old. What sparked me studying was actually driving to a women's circle one day. And anytime I saw this particular friend who facilitated women's circles, and she's a feminine embodiment coach, I always had epiphanies, and I was driving to the Women's Circle and for some reason was thinking about like, okay, what kind of job do I want to do? And, what kind of job would feel like I was never working a day in my life? And at the time, since planning for my second son, I had not stopped watching birth videos. The oxytocin boost from birth videos was so good, and my kids would watch them with me, and we love them. So at the time, my thoughts went to, oh, I just watch babies being born. Imagine how good that would be.
And then, and then I went to the women's circle and I voiced it like it was something that was silly and would never happen, and said like, you know, oh yeah, I think I, if I could do anything, I would be a birth doula maybe. And then they all said, why don't you? And I was like, well, that's completely impractical. And anyway, but because of their kind of, “Hey, why don't you investigate this?” I then went home, started googling, and you know, I had an 18-month-old, so I was like, well, I'm not going to be able to be a birth doula, but let's have a Google. And then came across your course, postpartum doula training. And I thought, ah, that! Because while I wouldn't be at a birth, I would be essentially part of a mother's journey, having a baby, and just being with mothers, which is really exactly what I wanted to do. And yeah, I realised I wouldn't feel like I was working a day in my life if I could work just being with mums and helping.
Julia Jones:
I love that. That is so hilarious that you were like, ha, wouldn't it be hilarious, and your friends were like, no, you actually can.
Jasmine Meek:
I guess because of that long running goal to be a psychologist one day and life getting in the way, and that career path being so intensive for all the study, my brain was just stuck in, if you want to have a job, you're going to have to jump through a million hoops and be so, so qualified. And that probably held me back from so many different things because I imagined it would just be really hard to get there. And then once I saw your postpartum doula course and I thought I could actually do this and qualify and start a business and then be doing something I love, not six years at uni, like, oh my goodness, this is amazing. So jump right in.
Julia Jones:
Yeah, it's a really good point. I've just signed up for a TAFE course, and I'm just really struggling with it. It's just so poorly designed. There's so much busy work. It's like the most non-conducive environment to study that you could ever imagine. And it is just so frustrating to me. And what it made me realise is that, yeah, I think a lot of people don't realise how much of a joy study can be. A lot of people complete my course within four or six months, and a lot of people race through it and are like, “Whoa. It was like so amazing. It was so interesting. I couldn't stop listening.” Because it's relevant to what you are interested in. And what it made me realise is that it's probably a big barrier for a lot of people going back into adult education is thinking that it's going to be really tedious, really hard, really long, lots of assessments that aren't related to practical kind of outcomes, you know? So it makes me really happy to hear that you did that. And then like you said, so that was only three years ago and now you're already working as a doula and have been for quite a long time. So what a great thing to just decide to do something, do it, and here you are.
Jasmine Meek:
I was one of those people that sped through it because I just loved it. And that was probably the only time in my life where I have felt the joy of learning. Oh, someone said a really great quote to me the other day when I brought this up, something about how learning is a joy and they were referring to kids. I can relate it to me it was something like, you know, studying is painful, but learning is a joy and whatever it was, it's probably a well-known saying. But I had only ever found studying to be a hard slog. I loved the early psychology lectures where it was just all this wonderful information about the way our brains work. And then just as you say, like, then you would have to do these essays and research papers that did not feel like they related at all.
And sometimes genuinely, I could not relate it to anything I would do in the future. For example, when the second time I tried to go back and study again after my first was born, I had a bio-psychology research paper about snails and the way they work. And we all just, oh my God, what are we doing here? And when I did your course, I was like, this is what people talk about when they say when you love what you are learning about. The studying is a joy. And I sped through it because I just could not get enough. I would get back to the computer and do more and I loved it. And I had my business. So from that moment of deciding and then starting the course immediately and then setting up my business, I think it was four months and I had the business set up. I was just so excited.
Julia Jones:
That is amazing. And did you get clients straight away? Did it take you a little while to get the hang of marketing?
Jasmine Meek:
I got clients straight away because I did the introductory offer where I was basically working for free and, you know, for $300 for three visits, including I brought food and all sorts. And, yeah, so it was essentially all that money just went back into supplies. But I had the luxury of being the non-breadwinner. And so I could do that. And getting clients when I was charging a much lower rate was a lot easier, but it was not sustainable. And over the years I've learnt and tried different things and gone back and forward. But still trying to find the balance between what can sustain me and the business financially with what gets clients through the door because they're not terrified of the big number. I think I'll always be evolving that part.
Julia Jones:
I think that's a really good point. Business is always evolving and a lot of people have the feeling that they have to get it right the first time and know exactly what the service is and exactly what the price is. But I think the way that you've done it where you just try a few things and then you adjust and you try a few more is much more realistic. And also your capacity as a mother is always changing as well. And now your kids are getting older and there are different services that you might be interested in offering, the financial needs of your family might change over time, you know, so there's nothing wrong at all with just trying something and then the next time changing it a little bit. I love that helped you to get started really quickly.
Jasmine Meek:
And you're right, different life circumstances. It is interesting, actually, last year I felt in a kind of slump in business because we were as a family slowly merging out of that kind of my husband as the breadwinner and me as the, you know, stay at home mum with this extra bit of income, that kind of thing. And as my son's getting older, and he is four and a half now, it was looking more like, now I need to kind of make this worthwhile. And I couldn't find that, I was looking for something to light a fire under me to make me make want money, because like, I'm, you've discussed on your podcast many times that the financial blocks that so many of us have, and then especially when we start our businesses postpartum, and we have that feeling like, I don't technically need the money. And then you grapple with some of those mental blocks of your business looking like a hobby, but you really want it to be legitimate and be bringing in a real income. And so I was grappling with a lot of that, and then it was like the universe listened, but in a really mean way. And my husband lost his job and was out of work for six months.
Julia Jones:
That gave a little nudge outta the nest that you were looking for.
Jasmine Meek:
Yeah. And I just was like, I didn't mean that, I just wanted to find it emotionally, not literally. And anyway, it did light a fire, and that's what sparked my newest service because I needed to make a decision, right? I need a much bigger client base. So I started working with mums of all stages of motherhood, not just the fourth trimester, which I was offering previously.
Julia Jones:
So your husband has another job now?
Jasmine Meek:
He does, yes. But he has had to basically have a complete career change, and he's on almost half of his income that he used to be on in the corporate world. And, yeah, he's had a big shift and it's still vital that now I bring in a real income, which is good. I'm glad of that because, I was worried, I thought, well, he'll find another job, but then do I lose momentum again? This way I keep momentum and it's given me that hunger that I needed, and then I'm hoping that I can keep that forever.
Julia Jones:
I think so. It's a story I'm working with at the moment that a family's allowed to have two income earners, because so often when the babies are really little, it really does feel like one parent is part-time at home, you know, and the other parent's more of the breadwinner, and you might switch roles a few times and that sort of thing, but also you're both allowed to earn lots of money. That's totally okay too.
Jasmine Meek:
Yeah. And it is really interesting the way that we have these, we have these strange imprints that we don't realise they're there until it's happening. And eventually it kind of comes to the front of mind and you go, oh, okay. Yeah, I didn't realise I kind of thought like that deep down, but I did, or I didn't realise I had that money block, but I did.
Julia Jones:
Yeah, we talk about this a lot too, don't we? But the journey of motherhood and also the journey of business ownership, it really brings all of that up. You have to face so many of those stories that you have and you didn't even know that you had and sort of figure out what's valuable and what the story is for the future and what you want to hold onto and what you want to let go of. So tell me about the new package that you, the new service you created being a mother's helper. How does that work?
Jasmine Meek:
I've got the kind of two areas that I work in. So one is the fourth trimester clients, so that's the pregnant mums. And then I work with them through their fourth trimester. And it's the premium package, it's the postnatal massage. And it's a premium service so that I can allocate lots of time to them, it means they get my full attention. But then now on with the other half of my time, I have the mother's helper, visits and their individual visits or book, however many, 10 in a row or regular. And they are for mums of the older babies, the toddlers, preschoolers, really any age. And it is very similar support to what we give as postpartum doulas. In the practical sense, when you are in the home, I'm cleaning, I'm cooking, I am talking with the mums and being that extra person in the house to support her emotionally hanging out with the child if I need to so she can do something or doing the things she needs done so that she can actually sit down and play some blocks with the toddler or that kind of thing, bit of organisation. That's really fun. That's a real dopamine hit for me is when they say, I really need my pantry organised. Yay. Let's do it. And we have a bit of fun together. And yeah, in those visits, they are three hours, but it's a turn up, do the job, leave. It's less of that background support, less of the planning. But it's beautiful because so many of my clients in the early stages of my business had said, you know, can't I have you around forever? And then other people who I would meet that had older kids would say, oh, I don't have a newborn anymore, or my child's two, I wish I could have the postpartum doula. It sounds exactly what I need. And I always wanted to give that service, but I was always concerned about how I would still be able to be technically a postpartum doula if all my clients ended up having older babies and kids.
But, the push from my own personal circumstances and inspiration from an old client who got me back in that time to just help her with housekeeping, she said, I need someone who does what you do, but just like in general. And I said, well, I could use the cash at the moment. Can I come and do that for you? And I did. And then we were talking, she's just saying how invaluable that was for her, and that combo of things happening all at once. And I started offering the package and heaps of mums have taken me up on it and half my week is spent doing those mother's helper sessions and they're fantastic. And they are just as fulfilling as the postpartum doula work. Just a different brand, you know?
Julia Jones:
I love it. So that was what I was going to ask you. So you're doing about half of that early intensive postpartum support and half of the mother's helper work?
Jasmine Meek:
Yeah. And I can, so because the mother's helper work is less of that background kind of support, I can squeeze two or three of those visits in a day because it's turn up, it's do the work and leave. And so I go from one client to another and I offer a witching hour support, a time slot where it's evening. And now that my kids are older, I can do that a few times a week. So yeah, so sometimes I could see three clients in a day, but then the next day, if that's with a fourth trimester client, the whole day is reserved for her. I make a point to never rush off from a fourth trimester mum because her needs could be really great that day and or something could happen right before I was meant to leave and baby starts crying and she's looking stressed, and so I don't go anywhere. I just stay as long as she needs.
Julia Jones:
Yeah, I love that because there is a much deeper, emotional element to that early work. It's much more space-holding, but there's also a lot more sort of questions that new mums have, and you might need to help her to book an appointment or ring a hotline or make a plan for, you know, her mental health or for breastfeeding. There's like just so much stuff. Whereas I imagine with older families, when the babies are a bit older, I can see so many practical times when a mum would want help, the dad's away for work, the witching hours you mentioned, maybe mum's had surgery or an illness. There's just so many reasons why you might just want someone to come over for a couple of hours, that don't necessarily need such a strong bond and relationship in a long-term kind of being held. I love that you've differentiated them so well, and then that's obviously managed to fill your week with clients.
Jasmine Meek:
So I think I found a good balance. And you're right, there was one of my mother's helper clients, her daughter, I only started the package and she kind of only found out right at the end, but her daughter had broken her leg. So for a couple of months her 4-year-old was not walking. And so she had just, she was just at the end the last few weeks of, just such intense mothering of a 2-year-old who needed her a lot, and then a 4-year-old who was back to needing to be carried everywhere. That was why she had booked me. So, some semi-regular sessions and she really just needed another mum to talk to and someone in her home that could also kind of lift up the 4-year-old and take her to the next room or be with the 2-year-old while she did. And it was really lovely to be able to support her through that. And it just got her through the tail end where she kind of felt like she was going mad.
Julia Jones:
I think that's a very relatable thing too, is that feeling when you're a mum alone with kids all day and you're just like, I just need another adult to talk to. I just want to have a conversation that's not about Bluey.
Jasmine Meek:
Yeah. Although I love Bluey, I would probably talk about Bluey a lot.
Julia Jones:
So maybe not Pokemon.
Jasmine Meek:
No. Yeah. Don't talk to me about Pokemon.
Julia Jones:
That's really beautiful. So, where do you see yourself in the future then? It sounds like you're in a really good place. Do you see any other big changes coming up or do you think you could just be doing this for a long time?
Jasmine Meek:
I feel like I have finally accepted that. I have no clue because, as we were speaking about earlier, that in each stage of motherhood, I had always felt like that was it, that was what it was going to be like forever, and really struggled to see the future that would be different. And we said, I wish we could go back in time. And I said, well, I wish someone told me. But then also people probably did tell me, and I wish I had listened or been able to fully understand that yes, life does change as your children grow older and you gain more capacity. And so I think I'm finally in that stage of, you know what? I do not know what it's going to be like next year to have two kids in primary school. I don't know. And I probably, the way, the way my brain works, it will probably be day one of sending my youngest two prep, you know, if it's a Monday morning, and I'll probably come home and have a fantastic idea about how I'm going to stru structure my business now that I have five full days.
It'll probably be something like that. But I feel like for the rest of this year, it's a case of learning to learning to manage a nearly full-time workload because it's built up pretty rapidly over the last year from that real part-time, nice and slow, part-time mothering, part-time work now to kind of, I'm doing this properly, which is also like, whoa, is this what it's like to work full-time ? Oh my goodness. But I also know that it's not the same as going to the office and coming home. Like our job is very different. You're going to different places and you are doing some background work at home and you're managing your own business. So I think, I hope that basically the next year looks like really finding the groove in that and then feeling like I have an established, self-sustaining business and just getting to rest in that for a tiny bit until the next epiphany.
Julia Jones:
I love it. I want to take you back to the beginning of this journey, and I don't remember exact words, but you were saying, if I could just do something I love doing and it wouldn't feel like work and it would be watching women birth.
Jasmine Meek:
Yes.
Julia Jones:
So how does that feel now? Is this what it's really like?
Jasmine Meek:
Yeah. And actually it's funny 'cause I do forget that like, that was actually the first little epiphany was to watch babies being born. And I did, and I have said all along the way, yeah, I'll probably do some birth doula training eventually and be a full spectrum doula. And then I think just the, yeah, the intensity that I didn't anticipate of running a business, it's all the background stuff that does feel like work, has made me just let that be something that might happen and not, I haven't kind of put it into a five year goal plan or anything. So I think right now I'm just, that's maybe that'll be the epiphany I have next year when I've got two kids in primary school. I'll go, maybe I'll do some birth door training, but for now, yeah, it is far more intense to run your own business than I ever anticipated.
And when I am with a client, yeah, I don't feel like I'm working. It's, beautiful. It wasn't straight away. I would leave a client's house emotionally exhausted and often I would leave a client's house and start feeling like I'd feel like I was getting sick. And it's the kind of thing that maybe if you were in a high-pressure job, you might not notice it so much if you just kind of worked in an office. But because of course, as we know, it is so important to not be sick around pregnant mums and new babies. I was so conscious of it. And after a while and working with a naturopath and my friend who's a feminine embodiment coach, we realised it was just the level of, tension I was probably holding, trying to do the best job and hold space for the mothers.
And being new to the job I must have been just holding so much tension in my body. Because often what would happen is I would get in the car and I'd think, oh my God, I feel like I'm getting a cold. Like it would just come out of nowhere the next day, I'd be fine. It's like my body was reacting to, holding it together too tightly. And so as I got more confidence in the job and did a bit of work around, being able to have like holding space isn't essentially, I think I was thinking like, I don't exist anymore. I have no emotions. This person is everything, do everything this person needs. And I had to learn on the job about having one foot in their world and what they needed, but also grounded in my own physical needs and that kind of thing.
So over the first year or so was slowly moving into a space where then it genuinely felt nourishing to me to nourish the mums. And I would actually leave a shift feeling like my cup was filled as well. And so, it got to the point where I didn't feel like it was work and it was so lovely. And sometimes I would just stay longer and longer and longer because even though at the start of my business I did have finish times, I would say it was a three hour visit, I would stay longer just because I was genuinely happy to be there. And I was like, we are in your bubble and it's so lovely and I get to be a guest here and I didn't want to go back into the real world. And then I'd get in the car and the bubbles burst for me and I'd go, oh, that's right. I've gotta go to Coles and do the shopping. So yeah, so I evolved in that way and the job. Now I'm in a client's home and it doesn't feel like work. It just feels like the most wonderful place to be. And if only there was a government grant for all us postpartum doulas to completely pay for all our marketing and admin and all of that to be done, then yeah. I would basically be in bliss constantly.
Julia Jones:
That's such an interesting thing and it really is something to work towards in the longer term, but just making this a form of employment because if you didn't have to do all the bookkeeping and the tax returns and the, you know, all those other building a website, it would be just, you could just go and be with mums. Yeah. And that would be amazing.
Jasmine Meek:
I think running a business and becoming a postpartum doula and many other similar jobs, I think where we have those epiphanies in motherhood that we want to do life differently. I've come to realise that it's okay for it to be an evolving process and it can be over years. We have this idea that, they say this huge percentage of small businesses fail within the first year. And it sounds very scary. And you think, okay, so I have one year to make this work. And I mean, I've got the privilege of not having to have my income feed the family for the first few years of running my business, which is a privileged position to be in. But yeah, many of the people who are doing the postpartum doula training are probably similar to me. And just to reassure them that it's okay for your business to evolve over a few years and that it does become even easier and different and you find what works for you and you find your niche. And that's all okay to not get it right immediately.
Julia Jones:
I love that. I just have two more things to sort of affirm with you and then we can wrap it up.I think if you had studied psychology, you would've still be studying now and you would also have a student debt. And so if it does take you a few years to get your business off the ground and you're not in debt in that time, you're still ahead. But the other thing is most businesses fail because they're trying to grow too fast. and that's just not just me. Anecdotally, I'm pretty sure that is like a statistic when businesses push, push, take on too much debt, take on too many, you know, responsibilities, suppliers, all of this kind of thing, and then they end up collapsing because it's not, it's not sustainable. So when you do just organically grow your business and you start out with a, your first few clients covering your costs, and then you know, you're a bit more part-time and then you grow to full-time, that's not the kind of business that fails. That is much more sustainable in the long term, until you decide you want to do something different, you know?
Jasmine Meek:
Yeah, definitely. And the great thing about being a sole trader and a service-based business is the overheads are a lot lower. You know, as long as you don't go and rent a space. Yeah. Like you say, and overcapitalize, you can slowly shift how you charge for your time and then how many extras you add on top of that in terms of the physical things you supply. So yeah, it's, it was really nice to be able to grow the service with the, yeah, with the time that I had and as you get bigger, then you can kind of add in new things, like, okay, now I'm going to also make gift boxes for my clients, things like that.
Julia Jones:
And you don't have to do that all at once in the first year of starting out.
Jasmine Meek:
Yes. Although it is of course very tempting, I'm sure for many of your students to go and do the bulk herb order and lavender and rose petals and all the things and essential oils.
Julia Jones:
Absolutely. I did it.
Jasmine Meek:
Yeah, I did it.
Julia Jones:
Thank you so much for sharing your story, Jasmine. And just before we wrap up, are there any last things that you want to share?
Jasmine Meek:
I think we covered so much and I just really appreciate Newborn Mothers. What you've put out into the world, it's so important. The role of a postpartum doula is so important, but also being able to access that training and I'm just so grateful because it changed my life.
Julia Jones:
That's so beautiful to hear. Thank you so much. If anyone's in, you are in Brisbane, aren't you?
Jasmine Meek:
Yes. I service clients Brisbane Redlands, but I'm based in Brisbane, Bayside.
Julia Jones:
Amazing. Thanks for sharing your story,
Jasmine Meek:
Thank you.
