Building connection and business with women’s circles
Interview with Rachael Rose
I chat with Rachael Rose of Together, a women’s circle facilitator training. We discuss her challenging journey into motherhood, doula work, and creating transformative women's circles. At the core of this conversation, we explore the importance of starting imperfectly and learning as you go.
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About Rachael
Rachael Rose is a mother, circle facilitator, business mentor, and community maker. She hosts women's circles on the South Coast of NSW and is the founder of an online course called Together: Women's Circle Facilitator Training where hundreds of women have joined from across the world and started circles in their communities. Her mission is to support women through life, motherhood, and business transitions. Her teaching style is humorous, engaging, compassionate, and a little sweary. As a mother of two, Rachael has grown her heart-centred business alongside homeschooling her children.
Learn more about facilitating women’s circles with Rachael here: https://rachaelrose.com.au/offers/together/
SPECIAL OFFER: Use the code NEWBORNMOTHERS for $100 discount!
(I may earn commission if you choose to purchase Together with my special discount. I only affiliate for programs I really think will help you better support new families.)
We explore the following questions:
How did you transition from being a registered nurse to becoming a doula, and what inspired this shift in your career?
What are the unique challenges and rewards of being a postpartum doula?
Why are women’s circles important, and how do they differ from casual social gatherings like playgroups or coffee catch-ups?
How can women’s circles provide deeper emotional support and connection for mothers?
What is the role of intention and storytelling in creating meaningful women’s circles?
How can mothers balance their personal growth, parenting responsibilities, and career aspirations?
What advice do you have for mothers who want to start their own business while balancing family life?
How do you adapt your business model to suit your personality, lifestyle, and family needs?
Why is marketing such a crucial aspect of running a postpartum business, and how can it help expand impact?
How can mothers create businesses that align with their strengths and values, instead of traditional models?
Where can people find women’s circles and begin their own journey of connection and support?
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Transcript
Julia Jones:
Hello and welcome to the Newborn Mothers podcast. Today I've got Rachael Rose on, and Rachael, I think we've been trying to do this for like over a year. Yeah, it's been a long time. And finally, our busy lives have managed to make it work. Rachael, if you don't know her, is a mother and a circle facilitator. She also does business mentoring and host circles both online as well as in real life in New South Wales, but also you teach, you have online courses now too. So I'd really like to kind of go back to the beginning and hear that story of how you became interested in, I guess it's kind of rites of passage work, isn't it? And then how you moved from doing that face-to-face into doing that more online. And yeah. How are you?
Rachael Rose:
I'm good, Julia. Thanks for having me. So my story starts in my pregnancy eight years ago, when I was 26, and I was 26 when I had my first baby too. So we made the decision to have a baby and I thought life would just continue as it would. I was working in Sydney in a corporate job, and I thought, well, I'll just get pregnant and I'll keep working and that's fine. And then I'll go back when Bub's three months old. And then I became pregnant and I had hyperemesis. So I had to reduce my work to eventually quitting that job because I was so unwell during that pregnancy. And we had moved to a new area in that pregnancy, so I didn't know anyone. And I found the whole experience of my pregnancy basically very tiring, exhausting, but I was devastatingly lonely.
I didn't have a network of women friends, other mothers around me to talk to, to share what I was going through. And so that was very hard. I also entered motherhood through the hospital system and came out the other side with birth trauma, which I had to untangle and unravel. And apart from the initiation being very difficult when I was at home with my baby, learning to breastfeed, co-sleeping, I fell in love with the act of mothering. And I'd gone from type A high achiever, all my value is determined by my productivity to diving deep into being this mother of this baby and just absolutely loving it. So I kept noticing that all of the books on my shelves now were about birth, breastfeeding, attachment parenting, evolutionary parenting. I read your work, I got interested in the work that you've done, and I was like, oh, maybe there's something in this. Maybe there's a new career here.
So I did a doula training. I attended births for a while. I was a home birth doula, which was really beautiful. I quickly realised for me that being on call with a young child was not sustainable. Especially considering I actually didn't know how to drive a car. So I only got my licence last year at age 35, and I was having to rely on my partner to drop me off at client prenatals or postpartum visits and being on call while I was still breastfeeding through the night. I breastfed both my children until they were three. It just wasn't working for me and we were looking to the future as well and wanting to homeschool. So from a very early stage in that business, I was looking at ways to increase flexibility and sustainability and to have different options other than just the intensity of getting more and more clients to kind of build up my income, but then also being on call.
So I did online doula work. I was supporting women as a distance doula, and that was even from preconception stage to postpartum. Now, obviously not being there physically, I couldn't provide actual hands-on care or give them food and that sort of thing. But I was doing a lot of emotional doula support and talking about rites of passage and the transformation that they were going through and introducing to them, them to the concept of trence as well, which was brand new to me until I learn it. And then everything clicked. And I also wanted to apply my doula skills to group work. And so that's when I started pregnancy circles, mother based circles, both in my backyard, but then also online. So this whole time I started the social media business account and I was sharing what I was doing all along the way and just really taking notice that there was quite a lot of interest in the women's circle side of things. And I think having had the experience of being so desperately lonely, being able to provide places where women could make friends, where women could share like the ugly side of pregnancy or motherhood where they could say how they were really feeling. That was a big drive for me to keep doing that kind of work.
Julia Jones:
Yeah, there's so many parallels in our stories. I also didn't learn to drive until I had my second baby. And, and same, I was already doing some doula work, not birth work, but having to get dropped off with my massage table by my dad or my husband. Eventually I learned to drive, I think I was about 30, but it, I think what it showed me as well is I actually really don't like driving. Like, the reason I didn't drive was because I only do it if I have to. And so for me, having a job that I don't have to drive to is actually like a huge improvement in my, my lifestyle and wellbeing. So yeah, it's funny, I mean that you can learn to drive, but then like if, if you hate it, then maybe try not to do it all the time.
Rachael Rose:
So I've had to, because we've moved again and I now live in a regional area where there's no public transport. There's no way I can get around. So after I had my second, and we made the move, it was an absolute necessity. And then also we are homeschooling now, so in order to get my children to the beach or to go for a bush walk, we need to be able to get there in a car. Our car is electric, so I've never had to put petrol in a car, which feels funny, but I just went straight down there. But yeah, I attended my last birth as a doula when my son, who's now four, I was 37 weeks pregnant. Don't recommend doulas be attending births at 37 weeks pregnant. But that's when I finished up with that work.
And basically on the other side of my son's birth, which was a home birth, which I absolutely loved, and was just so transformative and powerful, I then doubled down in creating a business that was really supportive of our family's needs and transitioning my partner out of a job that he'd been doing for 14 years and wasn't loving anymore, and being able to make the move away from our friends closer to family. And then he now manages a permaculture farm down here as well. So like everything we've been doing with the business over the last six years has been to create what we're getting to experience now, which is awesome.
Julia Jones:
Yeah. It's so intentional. I love it. And that is a beautiful thing about being a business owner, is you really can say like, what is my dream job? What kind of boss do I want? You know, how much super do I want to earn? How much holidays do I do I need? And you just create that. Which is great. The other parallel I was noticing as you were telling your story is circles as well. I was so lonely after I had my first baby, and I think it's maybe similar to you, partly because I was the first of my friendship group being quite young, and all my other friends were still, you know, working and partying and travelling, and I was breastfeeding and up all night, and it was a really big kind of split. And I didn't really know anyone else, you know, I had to make all new mum friends.
But same as you, I included mother's circles as part of my postpartum care packages right from the start. And I used to get people saying, oh, I've already got some friends. I don't really need a circle. I was like, it's included. You don't have to come, but you don't get a discount. Like it's part of the package. And people did come and go like, oh my gosh, that was completely amazing. I'd never thought that I would've, you know, needed that. But having a facilitated space is really different than just going to a playgroup or catching up with a mum for a coffee. So do you want to talk a little bit about, some people might not really know what is like what's a circle? How is that different than just catching up with a friend?
Rachael Rose:
Yeah, so I think there's the intention behind it as well as where you gather. So you wouldn't really hold a women's circle in the middle of a bustling cafe. You do want to carve out some space that's private and, not in the, vicinity of other people where they can hear what's going on. It's a chance to kind of slow down, do a few rituals. My circles are not particularly weird or wild. They're really more about community and connection and storytelling. So, you don't need to know anything about the moon phases or anything about, you know, spirituality or things like that to come to one of my women's circles. It's really about come and connect as women share your story, listen to others deeply. So as the facilitator, I'll usually introduce a theme. So in my mother's circles, we covered themes from like matrescence, you know, what, what, what the period of becoming a mother is like, sex and relationships and intimacy after having children, debriefing birth experiences and breastfeeding experiences. You know, the tension between being a mother and also being a creative or wanting to start a business or wanting to be with your children, but also explore other parts of yourself and your identity. So I would bring these different themes and these topics into this space. Even, you know, preparing for postpartum or postpartum healing, I would do that in the pregnancy circles. And then just having the opportunity to share really freely, without being given advice. So that's probably one way that it's different from maybe going along to a formal mother's group or something where everyone's kind of just talking at each other or over each other. I really try and create the spaces where the mother or the woman gets to share and then we acknowledge that she's shared and then we move on to the next.
It's not like we're then offering 15 ways that she can improve her situation or her circumstances, or I did this or I did that. It's really just allowing her to share what she needs to share. And so, you know, you hear stories that you might not hear outside of those spaces. Stories where mothers are admitting that they feel rage or that they're feeling really uncomfortable in their friendships and relationships because everything's changed and nobody quite understands what they're going through, or that they are really struggling with the wakes, breastfeeding their baby through the night, but they love it, but they hate it, but it's hard. And sleep deprivation is causing all of this challenge in their life. So you, you just get to hear the real stuff outside of maybe, I don't know what nappies to choose, or I don't know how many, what solids you're gonna start your baby on, kind of thing. So we are trying to get to the deeper levels of conversation.
Julia Jones:
Yeah. And the nuance as well, because I think the difference is if you say like, oh, I hate breastfeeding today. And then if you say that in a normal context, everyone will be like, well, why don't you just quit? But it doesn't mean that you want to quit. It just means that you want someone to, to hear you and your challenge and your struggles. So I think that's a really powerful thing. I think the other really powerful thing is it my experience of being in circles is then I, I reflect on things and I kind of look forward to what I'm gonna share, even when I'm outside the circle, knowing that I've got that dedicated space kind of booked in, gives me that time to reflect and think, about myself more throughout the whole week, you know? So I find that a really kind of valuable extension of circles that I guess I didn't realise until I'd been in circles myself.
Rachael Rose:
And we include other practices, reflective practices, journaling, meditation, maybe drum, drum journeys, singing, there's other ways that we're bringing in like nervous system regulation and calm, amongst what can be quite a frenetic and chaotic time of being a mother, especially if you've got mothers of toddlers and that kind of thing. So sometimes having that dedicated carved-out space to just come and sit and drink an entire cup of tea and go to the bathroom without someone hanging off you. Like in our, my mother's circles that were designed for, for women in their first year, babies would come with us and it's slightly different because there's more, more humans in the room and there's louder noises. But then I was running circles for mothers of mothers of toddlers and beyond, and usually that would be when they would be starting to leave their children at home and going, no, actually I want some separation here and I want to be able to go and do this for me and have these conversations for myself, and then I'll return to my family. Which was always nice to see as well.
Julia Jones:
So tell me about that transition from facilitating circles in real life to teaching other people how to, to run circles online.
Rachael Rose:
So I was sharing that, I was running them on my social media page and just little snippets of, you know, I'm setting up for a circle, or these are the themes we covered, or something like that. And I just kept getting questions, how do you do that? Where did you learn? Can I do this? And my answer to that was always, yes, you can. Why don't you start one? But just continually hearing so much fear around what if I say the wrong thing? Or what if I don't do it right? Or what if I put this thing out there and nobody turns up? Or what if my own experience is cloud my ability to facilitate? And so just lots and lots of questions. And I was running a, a circle for about nine months and when we made the decision to move, I let the women in the circle know that I was moving.
And apart from being sad, they were also, reflecting like, who is gonna keep this going? We need someone to run these circles. And I said, you can, but they didn't believe me and I could just see that I would say that I would move and nobody would do it. Like, you know, it does take someone to step into that leadership role to actually make it happen. And so I made the decision to run some workshops in my backyard and invite people to come along. And I just said, it's like how to start a women's circle 101 style. And I put them out there on social media and to the women in my circle and three workshops booked out within a week. And it was very validating to have the women locally to me sign up and want to come along. But what I noticed was I then was having strangers, people I didn't know join purely through my Instagram.
And I had some women travelling nine hours to come to these workshops in my backyard, which went for six hours. So that's when I thought, oh, well this, this idea needs to be online because obviously it's pretty difficult to travel nine hours to come to a workshop. And I also didn't have the capacity to keep running them in that space because we were moving. So I made the decision to shift it online. And I launched the course two years ago. It's called Together. It's all about bringing women together, bringing mothers together. And I've had 500 women join over the last two years from all over the world. So it's just been absolutely amazing. Every week I receive feedback that another circle started in, I don't know, Denmark, the Netherlands, South Africa, New Zealand, the UK, all around Australia. And so that's, yeah, I still run circles in person, but the bulk of my work now is around supporting other women to do it because I could only ever have 12 women in my backyard. But now I can facilitate the circles for potentially hundreds, if not thousands of women being able to get into these spaces.
Julia Jones:
Yeah. I love it. It's, it's really, again, so similar to how I started, but I love that when someone says like, how can I learn this? And you just say, well I guess I can teach you. Like, you're kind of looking around and you're like, no one's really doing this, so it, it's going to be me. But I always think it's really such a great thing to say yes to. because a lot of people wouldn't say yes to that and did so and now having this huge impact.
Rachael Rose:
I had my own fears of like, oh, am I the right person to do this? You know, I haven't been facilitating circles for 15 years. I haven't apprenticed with anyone. I've learnt this as I've gone. But I was at a stage where I had facilitated circles for a number of years and you know, I have a background in group work as well, and I have a background in marketing and communication. So putting it all together in an online course just made sense. And yeah, it was, the first version was very imperfect. It was recorded quite, budgetly in my backyard, the course itself. And I've since redone it and launched a second version, which I'm proud of both versions, but like the first one was pretty scrappy, but you know, I just had to start. And it still had the impact. People still started women's circles after that. So it's a great example of just beginning and knowing that you don't have to be the absolute expert, best person that ever lived to start something to make an impact. And you will get better as you go as well. Like I'm a better teacher now two years later.
Julia Jones:
Yeah. But also because we are working in like, traditionally women's work that has been historically excluded from all kinds of academic institutions, there isn't qualifications that you can get in so much of this caring rites of passage type work. And so, of course then our generation of women are like, but I don't have a PhD in this topic. And it's like, well, you can't. Of course you don't have a bachelor’s degree. It doesn't exist, but someone's gonna have to start. And so we just have to start the ball rolling, don't we? And then hopefully for our daughters and our granddaughters it'll be really different.
Rachael Rose:
Exactly.
Julia Jones:
So tell me a little bit behind the scenes. You’re saying like after six years you've sort of seen the fruits of your labour and the sort of the intentions are manifesting into reality. So what, what are some of the joys and challenges of being a mom and a small business owner? And how do you manage it all?
Rachael Rose:
Yeah, so this year has probably been the most balanced. I don't think there's ever balance really, but I'm, I'm trying to do the best that I can. Homeschooling is a value of mine and I want to be involved in the homeschooling of the children, but I also love my business and I love my work. And so I want to have a creative outlet and a place where I can put my passions as well. So I want to do both. And so through the launch of together and seeing the success and the ability to live a lot more flexibly, because what I have now is it is an evergreen offering. Anybody can buy it at any time. Someone purchased it yesterday. And then I do a live launch model once or twice a year. So, you know, my downtime is really focused on how I can market the course, but I'm not delivering the materials all throughout the year.
So it does give me more spaciousness in how I like set up my day and what my calendar looks like and that kind of thing. And it gave us the chance for my partner to step out of the work that he was doing. So we now pretty evenly split parent and homeschool together. So we're both with the kids three days each per week. And then the other has them on the other time. So we don't see each other as much as we would like, but, you know, the kids are with either one of us throughout the week, which is really cool. And when we homeschool, we are very much of the unschooling, natural based learning philosophy. We spend a lot of time out in nature, out in our community. We're part of a homeschool co-op, which is just like my community-building dreams as well, to be part of a group of other parents and families that are homeschooling and really excited about homeschooling as well.
So we're out a a lot during the week, at the beach, like three times a week, bush walking, all of that kind of thing. And then I'm in my backyard studio two days a week really working on my business and supporting my clients. Because I also do business mentoring as well. But yeah, it was just going okay, like I don't have to work nine to five Monday to Friday to make this business happen. My partner can step into a different role. He can parent alongside me, you know, if I'm 100% honest, I wouldn't be homeschooling if it was all up to me. I know there are lots of families that do it, but it's a lot, usually typically on the mother's shoulders to be facilitating that whole experience. Whereas I feel like I'm able to share the load with my partner in a really big way. And when I'm working, he's with the kids, so I don't even have to stress about like the mental load of that side of things. I've got two neurodivergent kids as well. So our lifestyle really supports their needs as well. And knowing that when I'm working he’s with the kids and they're fully supported, I can just switch off from mothering on those days, which I really love as well.
Julia Jones:
It's so important, isn't it, to have that, that exactly. Like when women come to the circle and they've like put that hour aside for themselves, but having that time for you in your week is really valuable.
Julia Jones:
So tell me, what's next for Rachael Rose? Are you kind of big dreams and plans for the future? Or are you pretty happy with how things are ticking along?
Rachael Rose:
Yeah, so I'm in my third year where my business is earning six figures. And so it's really just been about consolidating and keeping that going. I do have big dreams, but I'm also quite a realist, pragmatic and grounded in reality that we are living a really wonderful lifestyle and at the moment I'm not super stressed in either corner of parenting or business, and I quite like that. So next year I'd like to just maintain the level that I'm at. I plan my business always the calendar year before. So I've got my income for the next year all sorted. I've launched and then I'll just get payment plans, which also is really supportive of my nervous system to know like, okay, money's coming in. But I will plan another live launch of Together.
I did the first affiliate launch, this year, which was really successful as well. So that was really beautiful in that I was able to give back to the community as well. They were able to promote the course on my behalf and I was able to pay them for that work. And that feels really nice and something that I want to keep doing and expanding so that other mothers who are maybe at the initial stages of their business are starting to see the possibility of, oh, okay, I can promote something online and I can sell something and I can make some money from it. And often it's a lot easier to sell other people's things. but through the affiliate programme I was also saying, Hey, you know, you've got these offers, why don't you start talking about your own work as well?
But in terms of the grand vision, like I do see one day 10,000 people going through together. So I'm at 500 now, so I'm a while away. Next year is all about doubling down on the marketing efforts and learning as much as I possibly can about online digital marketing so that I continue to get it out to as many people as possible. Because, you know, when I'm not launching, I get maybe one sale a month. It's not something that's sustainable. I do actively have to be promoting it and I'm looking at all the different ways I can make that happen next year.
Julia Jones:
Yeah. I think a lot of people don't realise that if you are running one of those leveraged businesses, the work then is the marketing. You know, once you've kind of created the scalable product that, you know, whether it's a book or whether it's a course or whatever, you don't need to keep working to deliver it. You need to do the work to sell it. But it sounds like you love business and marketing
Rachael Rose:
I do. Well, my background's in marketing, so it's very easy to be excited about that side of my business as well. But yes, I wish I made thousands of sales in my sleep, but no, that doesn't currently happen. It's very much about like, okay, how can I make this happen and what new strategies do I need to do? And okay, now I need to learn about search engine optimization and fully work on my website, or now I need to learn about automating on Instagram, or now I need to learn more about affiliate marketing. And so yeah, that, that is exciting to me. I know other people are gonna be rolling their eyes and saying, oh, that sounds like a real drag. but for me, the end result is that more women's circles get started. So, you know, I don't want to shy away from the selling and the promoting because otherwise the impact is not there.
Julia Jones:
Yeah, I totally agree. And I obviously geek out over business and marketing stuff too, but I think what people sometimes miss is it really is just about connection. Really marketing is just that building that trust, building that relationship and like sort of proving to people that you've got something that can, can make a difference. And you know, I guess it requires a little bit of confidence because you're having to tell people my thing's good.
Rachael Rose:
Yeah, yeah.
Julia Jones:
But like you said, the end result is a really positive impact on the world. So yeah, I, I think it's well worth the effort. But it's not really for everyone. Because I'm more introverted, so for me, there's no way I could fill my calendar with home visits. There really was a limit on my own energy levels and how much I can spend time with people, either face-to-face or in groups even on Zoom, so everyone should build the business that works to their strengths and kind of meet their needs. And it sounds like you're doing that.
Rachael Rose:
And likewise I love people, but I'm also an introvert and it takes a toll on me when I facilitate groups in person or online. And so I need a lot of spaciousness in my calendar. Like, I do work with clients one-on-one, but my limit is two calls per day. If I do more than two hours worth of calls, I don't have any juice left in the rest of the day. I've also made the decision I can't work with people in the UK on a one-on-one basis because that would mean I'd have to be working early mornings or evenings. So I can't do that. I've never run women's circles of an evening because it's never supported my family life. I really have had to go with what suits my temperament, my personality, my strengths, my challenges, and how can I create the business that supports that?
Julia Jones:
I think that's so inspiring for people to hear as well because it means that all the other mothers in the world can go like, okay, so I'm allowed to do that too.
Rachael Rose:
Yeah. And you obviously want lots of people to do postpartum care work because that is really important. We need women on the ground doing that work as well. But it just might not look like, okay, five days a week you have three clients a day, it might need to be spread out more and then bringing in other online offerings so that you've just got a little bit more diversity. And when everybody's sick in the family, you know, the whole business doesn't kind of cave in.
Julia Jones:
Yeah, absolutely. And that's gonna be different for everyone at different stages of life and really important to just keep in touch and, and stay, flexible about that. So where can people find you and learn more about what you do?
Rachael Rose:
I mainly hang out on Instagram, so yeah, my handles @ _RachaelRose, and then website rachaelrose.com.au. I'm on Instagram most days. Sometimes it's useful. Other times I waste a little bit of time on there, but I have really used Instagram as a way to connect to community and it has been the thing that has helped me establish my business probably more than anything. And it's now that I'm like, okay, all my eggs were in Instagram, I need to do something else. But what a powerful tool to be able to connect with other mothers, who are often at home with their bubbles, breastfeeding and, and looking to connect with other people who get it as well.
Julia Jones:
Yeah, absolutely. Have you got any last things to share?
Rachael Rose:
Oh, just find a women's circle, to anybody that's listening. We just finished our last women's circle of the year, for my in-person group. And you know, I don't want to be hyperbolic, but you know, attending a women's circle regularly can change your life because the ability to really show who you are to other women and to be witnessed in all of your flaws and all of your wonderful character traits. And it, it, it does something to your whole body, to your brain, to your life, to your relationships, to the way you can show up and parent and be a partner. I just continually get that feedback from people who attend women's circles, that it is one of the most supportive practices that they've been introduced to. So go find a women's circle.
Julia Jones:
I love it. That's so beautiful. Thank you, Rachael.
Rachael Rose:
Thank you.
