Podcast Episode 86 - The postpartum experience of the Australian Birth Stories
Interview with Sophie Walker
I chat with Sophie Walker, the founder and host of Australian Birth Stories, the podcast with over 8 million downloads. From recording episodes in her car to advocating for change through parliament, this conversation with Sophie is not to be missed.
Together, we discuss Sophie's personal journey of starting the podcast and turning it into a business. We explore how Sophie's experience in public health shapes her work and how her passion for birth flowed into postpartum care. At the core of this conversation, we reflect on the importance of bringing who you are and what you're good at together to bring about deep change.
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About Sophie
Sophie Walker is the founder and host of Australian Birth Stories, the podcast with over 8 million downloads that’s endorsed by the Australian College of Midwives. Sophie has just released her first book, 'The Complete Australian Guide to Pregnancy and Birth', co-authored with Jodi Wilson. Sophie has got a Masters in Public Health and a passion for encouraging women to actively prepare for birth and postpartum. Beyond the microphone, Sophie is a mum to three rambunctious boys who create a lot of joy and mess.
We explore the following questions:
What were you doing before Australian Birth Stories and what made you take the leap into podcasting?
When did you decide Australian Birth Stories needs to be a business? How did you make that change?
What drew you to move beyond birth stories and into the importance of postpartum?
What gave you the idea to write the book ‘The Complete Australian Guide to Pregnancy and Birth’?
What are the next steps for you and for Australian Birth Stories? What’s driving you to create an annual study and report?
Where can people buy The Complete Australian Guide to Pregnancy and Birth?
Our favourite quotes:
"So when my birth went so pear shaped, I was really shocked. And then I had a really beautiful five hour second birth and I was like, "Wow, I just want to share the good stories now." - Sophie
"I just worked from home and recorded most of my podcast interviews in the car because I've got three very noisy boys. The first four years of the content on the podcast is all in my car." - Sophie
"I got to a point where I was like, "Oh postpartum's so important and no one's talking about it and there's so much involved and there's no support or funding and how can I kind of shine more light on this area of things?" - Sophie
"I think it's really inspiring for people to hear that you can actually do something that you enjoy that makes a positive impact on the world and that can earn you enough money to not only feed your family but also buy a house." - Julia
"Another big shift in this book is we're addressing the mother. It's very mother focused rather than, "Here's what's happening with your baby and it's the size of a pear this week." It's more like your body's changing in this way, you might be emotionally feeling this way." - Sophie
Additional resources we spoke about:
Australian Birth Stories - https://australianbirthstories.com/
The Complete Australian Guide to Pregnancy and Birth - https://australianbirthstories.com/shop/the-complete-australian-guide-to-pregnancy-and-birth/
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Transcript
Julia Jones:
Hello and welcome to Newborn Mothers podcast. Today I'm really thrilled to have Sophie Walker here from Australian Birth Stories podcast. And we've been circling around each other for years and I'm glad we finally managed to connect here on the podcast.
For those of you who don't know, I think if you're Australian, you probably know the podcast, Australian Birth Stories. If you're not, Sophie has a background in public health. But after her own experiences of having her three babies, realized that there was a big gap in this area of birth and started the podcast. And here you are today, wildly successful. I think it's must be one of the biggest podcasts in Australia. Am I making that up? It feels massive.
Sophie Walker:
Yeah. Not in Australia. I think Hamish & Andy have got that title, but.
Julia Jones:
Well, that's true. Yeah. They win all those titles, don't they?
Sophie Walker:
Yeah.
Julia Jones:
But you do have 10 million downloads. You've shared over 350 birthing stories. Definitely in terms of women's health, I'd say your podcast has got to be right up there and I'm thrilled to have you on the show.
Sophie Walker:
Yeah. Thanks so much for having me. I think we were just chatting, we started kind of online, in the online world about the same time in roughly 2017. So we've sort of seen each other around but not connected. So it's lovely to meet you.
What were you doing before Australian Birth Stories and what made you take the leap into podcasting? (01:50)
Julia Jones:
Yes, lovely to meet you too. So tell me, let's go back to the beginning. You were working in public health and you had your own birth experience. So what were you doing before and what made you take this leap?
Sophie Walker:
I was working part-time, and when I started the podcast, I was working part-time at the Cancer Council of Victoria. And I was interviewing kind of family members with a history of preexisting history of cancer. So I've always kind of worked in the research interviewing space. So that kind of wasn't new to me. But I'd had one son, I got three boys. I'd had my first son at that time and I was back from maternity leave. And his birth was a real shock to my system. It was sort of 36 hours, quite instrumental, postpartum hemorrhage, a bit touch and go for both of us. And then everything turned around. But I was just rocked by that. And I went in really confident, had always been interested in birth and kind of toyed with the idea of doing midwifery. So I was always interested in that space. So when my birth went so pear-shaped, I was really shocked.
So approaching, I was working part-time and approaching my second birth. I really wanted to, I felt like I was missing a piece of the puzzle in birth preparation, so I really just absorbed as many birth stories as possible. So I wasn't surprised this time around. And then I had a really beautiful five-hour second birth and I was like, "Wow, I just want to share the good stories now."
“So when my birth went so pear-shaped, I was really shocked. And then I had a really beautiful five-hour second birth and I was like, "Wow, I just want to share the good stories now."
And I was drawing on English and American stories and podcasts because podcasts weren't as big here at that time. And a friend of mine who I was working with were packing kind of saliva testing kits and getting DNA samples and things and she said, "You should just do your own podcast and do Aussie stories and the Australian healthcare system." And yeah. So I thought, all right, I'll have a go. And I literally just followed a YouTube of how to set up a podcast. And I'm not techy at all, so I just went step by step, okay, do this, do this, copy and paste. And yeah, set it up.
And yeah, had hardly, I had no expectations that it would turn into a business. I just thought I'll share my story and if people listen and take something from it, then that'd be wonderful. So I originally was kind of approaching family and friends to share their stories. And now I've got over 5,000 applications through the website. So it's really shifted from where it began.
Julia Jones:
Yes. Now people want to be on your podcast. It really was a gap back then. I had my first baby in 2010 and I remember same, being desperate for birth stories. I just really wanted to, I don't think podcasts hardly even existed then. I don't even know if they did. So I was usually reading books or watching documentaries. But most of them were in that genre of Ina May Gaskin, Orgasmic Birth, Business of Being Born. They were all super woo-woo, kind of out there like birthing with dolphin stuff.
And I just really wanted to hear normal people's birth stories. So I can really relate to that desire that women have. Because we don't spend so much time, I guess sitting around talking about those things with our friends. We don't necessarily have any experience about birth before we have our own babies. So yeah, I can really see why that gap was so needed and became so popular.
When did you decide Australian Birth Stories needs to be a business? How did you make that change? (05:20)
Sophie Walker:
I got to a point, I kept working part-time and kind of I was just sending emails and things on my lunch break from work. And I thought once I'm earning the same wage that I'm making part-time at the Cancer Council, then I'll let that job go and I'll invest in the podcast. So I kind of think it's funny, I listen to, mostly listen to now instead of birth podcasts, business podcasts because I'm always trying to up-skill.
And I feel like people kind of just go, "Oh, I'm going all in." And they just kind of jump in and take a big risk. And I feel like I was a little bit more calculated. I wanted to make sure. I mean, my husband was working full-time, but I wanted to make sure I wasn't going to come out at a loss. So I protected myself there. And the only income I was generating at that time was a little bit of money from the podcast ads.
And to get those, I just called brands that I knew and loved back then, sort of yeah, postpartum products and different things. I think I reached out to BodyICE Woman and things like that and said, "Would you be interested in sponsoring an episode of the podcast?" And I think back then I'm like, "I've got a hundred people listening each week and for 80 bucks or something, do you want to run an ad?"
And they sort of thought, I don't know if people anticipated that maybe this would take off or whether they thought they'll just give it a go or what, but people were really lovely and said, "Sure." And so I started to make a bit of revenue in that way. And then I thought if I stop working part-time, I'll have a lot more time to invest in the podcast. So I did more work in kind of making, my Instagram page is a big driver of traffic for me.
So I sort of invested more time in those sorts of channels. And I feel like everyone in business says grow your email list in the beginning. And I didn't do that. So I didn't do that till a few years in to really actively try and capture that audience. So I often reflect back and think, "Oh imagine if I had a freebie and was getting everyone's details in the beginning." But I did that later in the game.
But yeah, so then rather than commuting to the city back and forth and kind of handing the kids to my mum, very graciously minded, my kids for me, I just worked from home and recorded most of my podcast interviews in the car because I've got three very noisy boys. So I had two at the time. But it was easier for me to say, "I'm going to be in the car for an hour," rather than try and get everyone to be quiet in the house. So yeah, the first four years of the content on the podcast is all in my car, various cars.
“I just worked from home and recorded most of my podcast interviews in the car because I've got three very noisy boys. The first four years of the content on the podcast is all in my car.”
Julia Jones:
I love that. I really, it just feels so achievable for someone who's thinking like, "Oh, starting a podcast sounds really hard." But the times were a little bit different then. I still think anyone can start a podcast. I had no idea what I was doing when I started my podcast. But in 2017 I think that was probably, you were riding that wave of Instagram, I think you were probably in perfect time.
Sophie Walker:
Yeah, good audience.
Julia Jones:
I think if people started now, it wouldn't be Instagram. Maybe you could get your traffic off TikTok or something. But yeah, it's ultimately an email list, but you just must have kind of lucked out with that timing. When I started in 2010, it was Facebook. Facebook was free and ads didn't exist and businesses got so much reach. It was amazing to think of how easy it was to go viral back then. But now, you'd never think that that could happen.
Sophie Walker:
Yep.
Julia Jones:
Yeah. So it does change over time. The other thing I wanted to mention was that it is really important to talk about that risk appetite. Because some people do go into business and they're just free falling and take huge risks. And I've say I'm more that kind of person. I just quit my job and we needed the money. There was no choice about not making money.
But not everyone likes that amount of pressure. It just depends on your personality type and how you like to do things. So there's really not one right way of getting started. So I think it's really nice to hear that.
What drew you to move beyond birth stories and into the importance of postpartum? (09:26)
Julia Jones:
So once the podcast was obviously quite popular, you had some ads. And you became interested in postpartum, which I find so interesting because it's called The Australian Birth Stories podcast. So what then drew you into postpartum?
Sophie Walker:
I think I was just walking that path myself at the time trying to recover. And I've shared a lot throughout. I've shared all my birth stories on the podcast now as well. And I had, well, I had forceps in my first birth and quite a few complications which led to a prolapse, which I've still got now, which didn't worsen over the next few pregnancies, but it's an ongoing thing for me.
So I was always seeing a women's health physio and kind of in that space. And I was quite fortunate in breastfeeding, but I was really interested in that. I breastfed all my boys kind of past two-ish. So I was doing kind of, I was going to say extended breastfeeding into, in these days people would assume that's extended even though there's no...
Julia Jones:
Normal breastfeeding. Yeah.
Sophie Walker:
Yeah. Yeah. So I was feeding for longer and I was interested in kind of yeah, depletion and kind of Oscar Serrallach work and things like that. So I was kind of living that.
I got to a point where I was like, "Oh postpartum is so important and no one's talking about it and there's so much involved and there's no support or funding and how can I kind of shine more light on this area of things?"
And I was going to do a new podcast on postpartum. And at that point, I was kind of looking for a bit of guidance because I thought I've just yeah, making random decisions. And I saw a business coach who said, "I don't think you should do another podcast. I think you should make an online course." And it's interesting because I'd, in the business podcasts, I'd been listening to, I'd heard a lot of people talking about kind of passive income and setting up these courses that just did their own thing.
And you wake up in the morning and there's money in your account. And I thought that's never going to work for me because I'm not an obstetrician and I'm not a women's health physio and I'm not a midwife even though I've got an interest in all of these areas.
But I sort of in a way took the concept of interviewing through the podcast and made an interview series with some of the healthcare professionals that I was seeing personally, interviewed them and put together an online package, which again, I just followed step by step. A lot of those course platforms are very hand holding and they really just take you through how to do it. So I found that quite easy.
And then I kind of just, I remember kind of hitting go on that thinking, "It'd be great if someone buys it" and having no idea of how it would evolve. So I started with one kind of four-part series and then I made another kind of follow-up series that involved more about kind of sex and libido and looking after the baby. So a bit more of a holistic approach to postpartum care. And it's kind of changed names over the years, but it's now called Discovering Motherhood and I still sell that course.
Yeah. And then more recently, last year I made another course, The Birth Class. And yeah, now I've written a book. So it's changed in a lot of ways. And it's, yeah, there was a real shift from I'm just sharing stories and doing this for the love of things to, "Oh hang on, might be onto something here and this can really earn us as a family, a good living and has led to us buying a house last year and things." So it's really gone beyond my wildest dreams really.
Julia Jones:
Yeah, that's amazing.
“I think it's really inspiring for people to hear that you can actually do something that you enjoy that makes a positive impact on the world and that can earn you enough money to not only feed your family but also buy a house. “
It doesn't just have to be a hustle or pocket money or a hobby kind of thing too. It can be your full-time income. So I find that so inspiring and I love hearing those stories, particularly when you think back to the beginning and you started out sitting in your car.
Sophie Walker:
Yeah. And I had just some random people I'd never met come to my house and I'd interview them as well. It's funny, now I do it all online. But yeah, it's really made a huge shift. And recently, my husband's a teacher, and he's recently resigned and so I'm the sole earner for the family at the moment. So we've made a real shift in a lot of ways, so. And I think-
Julia Jones:
Sorry, I was going to say he's just stay at home now, or is he?
Sophie Walker:
Yeah. So and he's a primary school teacher, so he's just, he's better at active play than me anyway. So I think that the boys are getting a better deal with him. He's more the fun parent.
Julia Jones:
Yeah. Yeah. I think this is really a common dream, I think for a lot of couples, isn't it? And unfortunately, my husband loves his job too much to quit. But he's more the primary carer than I am. He does all the school pickups and drop-offs and things now. Yeah. But it's an interesting thing when a woman can find something like this that really works, then you don't have to conform to those gender roles any longer.
Sophie Walker:
Definitely.
What gave you the idea to write the book ‘The Complete Australian Guide to Pregnancy and Birth’? (14:26)
Julia Jones:
So tell me about your book, The Complete Australian Guide to Pregnancy and Birth. I did get to have a sneak peek, a preview copy. So what I'm really excited about it as we've kind of heard from your story now is that it really just doesn't end at birth. It does include postpartum, a really quite significant section on postpartum, which I really appreciated. You want to tell us about what gave you the idea to write that book?
Sophie Walker:
Yeah. I think in the same way that I felt like the podcast kind of filled a gap that we couldn't see anything doing what we were after or I couldn't, I was working by myself then, but I've co-written it with Jodi Wilson, who I know you are familiar with. Who's also got her own beautiful book she's written.
But we were saying, and I'm always asked, "What book should I get? What book should I get? I'm listening to the podcast every day, but what book do you recommend?" And kind of as you touched on before, Ina May Gaskin kind of springs to mind and that's American based stories and references and quite dated now as well. And there's a few other kind of comical books out there that kind of make light of some of the more harrowing parts of pregnancy and birth.
And we just felt that there wasn't a comprehensive Australian one that really covered all the things that we thought were important. So we set about doing it was a massive project. We spent about 18 months putting it together. And yeah, we're so incredibly proud of it. I've got it sitting here now just looking at it.
Yeah. So it's exciting to finally have it out into the world. We keep reading it and being moved by it, going, "Oh imagine when everyone else is reading it." And people that haven't been in this space and are familiar with a lot of the concepts and terms, we just, yeah, it feels like a real gift to the Australian birthing community. So I can't wait for them to read it.
Julia Jones:
Yeah. I think what's really so exciting about this book is it is a really comprehensive complete journey throughout the whole time. I don't know, I specialize in postpartum, so my book is really only about postpartum. And even then it's quite specifically about, I guess the more maternal transformation and traditional cultural care and that sort of thing. So I don't really cover even on, in my book, on just things like what to expect from the physical changes in your body.
Whereas I feel like your book is a really big picture overview of everything. And then people might want to dive into little more niche areas or they might need specific help with one thing. But I don't, I agree with you, I don't think there's one book that just has that big overview of everything that you need to know and all the things that might come up. It's very comprehensive.
Sophie Walker:
Yeah. And I think, I feel like people weren't quite sure what to expect from it too, because I do do the birth stories, would it be a coffee table book of beautiful birth imagery and just birth stories. But it's not. It actually doesn't have any photos.
It's got graphic illustrations. But we tried to keep the focus on, it goes through the first three, the three trimesters. And it does touch on the fourth, although I feel very pleased that you said that about postpartum, but we felt like we did a real acknowledgement that postpartum, as you say, needs a whole book in itself.
And we didn't want to kind of drop people at the end of pregnancy like, "Oh, now you've had your baby, off you go." But we also, so we have kind of fed into the first six weeks, but also acknowledged that it's a huge, huge area that yeah, would need its own book. And we didn't want to just go, "Oh, here's a paragraph on pelvic floor rehab and here's a paragraph on this." We wanted to gently lead people onto resources to really prepare themselves.
But I think kind of acknowledging the challenges of postpartum, we kind of feel like if one in three women in Australia report having birth trauma, if we can help prevent some of that trauma and prepare women in the pregnancy for the challenges of postpartum, then hopefully that kind of handholding and education through all of that experience kind of brings them into the postpartum space much more prepared. And yeah, so I think through birth education, through going through kind of, we go through all the common challenges and we touch on kind of HG and what to expect from your body.
But there's also, another big shift in this book is we're addressing the mother. It's very mother focused rather than, "Here's what's happening with your baby and it's the size of a pear this week," that kind of stuff. It's more like your body's changing in this way, you might be emotionally feeling this way, you might have physical symptoms that are like this and then detailing it.
Another big shift in this book is we're addressing the mother. It's very mother focused rather than, "Here's what's happening with your baby and it's the size of a pear this week." It's more like your body's changing in this way, you might be emotionally feeling this way.
And interweaving kind of information from perinatal specialists. We don't pretend to kind of hold all this knowledge ourselves. So it's woven through with expert information and statistics from Australia. And yeah, just to educate and inform throughout that whole process. And then within that informative chapters, we've woven in relevant birth stories that have been on the podcast. So when we talk about HG, then we've got a firsthand account of how a woman's experienced it.
And similarly with miscarriage, Jodi and I are fortunate enough to have never experienced a miscarriage. So we've gone out and sought those firsthand accounts from women that have walked that path and just acknowledged that one in four people. So a lot of people that purchased the book, even though they're not expecting to lose their baby, very sadly, they might find themselves in that situation.
And we've really detailed what's involved, because that I think is very hush hush. People like, "Oh, I've had a miscarriage." But they haven't said, "It started with bleeding and I had to make the decision to have a D&C" or "I decided to birth at home" and things like that. So I feel like we've uncovered some of the things that still aren't freely kind of discussed.
Julia Jones:
Yeah, I agree. Yeah. I think what strikes me as well is that you've said quite openly that you're not an expert, but the thing is, when women see a gap and there are so many gaps for women, not just in kind of birth and postpartum, but really across the board, you kind of look over your shoulder and you're like, "Where's the leadership? Who's going to do something about this?" And then you realize it's you, there's no one else. And so you've made that effort to gather those resources and find out that information and pull it all together for people. And I just think that's so, it's a gift. So thank you for doing that.
Sophie Walker:
Oh, well, thank you.
What are the next steps for you and for Australian Birth Stories? What’s driving you to create an annual study and report? (21:25)
Julia Jones:
And tell me what's next? The book's obviously... So when we release this in February, no, we said 31st of January, the book's going to be coming out. And what do you think the next steps are for you and for the podcast?
Sophie Walker:
Yeah. It's interesting. I think I'm not coming at this with the anticipation that it would be a business and not having business experience, I'm kind of reverse engineering all of that and kind of managing staff now and kind of allocating time and things. And I feel like just because I have got my husband at home full-time, doesn't mean I want to let go of some of those parenting roles.
I still want to do coffee after drop off with the mums. So I'm learning now how to kind of structure the business so that I can get. I mean, there's so many pros to working for yourself and being able to shape the way you run your day, but I feel like it's very easy to let that slide. And perhaps at the moment I've had a very busy year of getting the book together and we've rebuilt the website and I've also just made a cesarean birth course.
So it's been a very busy year and now I would like to sit back a bit, except I've got some amazing very talented people in my team that are like, "Okay, we need to do this and we should seize this opportunity and do this." So we're talking about creating an annual study and report just because I've got such a beautifully responsive and kind of invested audience.
I've got 37,000 beautiful women in my database who are often kind of responding and things and are like, oh, we need to kind of harness that power and that kind of drive of everybody and get some firsthand accounts, not just of their birth experience, but of the healthcare system and things and use that data to help get kind of better facilities and better funding and things.
So yeah, we've started consulting with different organizations that would help structure that. And I toyed with the idea of doing a PhD, but I came to my senses quite quickly. I think it's a lot of work. My kids, I still haven't toilet trained my three-year-old, so I'm still in the thick of actually parenting.
I don't think I need to take on a PhD. But yeah, how to kind of use all this kind of attention and trust and love for the show and what we're doing and kind of help get some changes in through parliament and things like that. So yeah, I'm not sure if we need to hit pause and do that in a year, whether I can just recover, but.
Julia Jones:
That's funny. We're in the exact same place with that. I looked at doing PhD as well. I published one research article with a friend of mine who's an academic, just as a trial. I was like, "I just want to get a little taste of this academic world." Oh, it nearly destroyed me.
Sophie Walker:
Good, tell me more about that. I need to hear that at the moment.
Julia Jones:
So the PhD idea went out the window.
Sophie Walker:
I'll leave it to Hannah Darlan and some amazing people that are doing fantastic research there, but yeah.
Julia Jones:
But doing an annual survey is a great idea because given you have a public health and research background, it does make sense. And you've got the audience that you can actually just pull that data. Just do a snapshot once a year, and then...
Julia Jones:
And then the advocacy work. It doesn't need to be a PhD to be impactful. You know?
Sophie Walker:
Yeah. And I should say I got 51% on stats and I think that was purely because my lecturer didn't want to see me again for another year. So it's not my strong suit to analyze the data. So that's why there'll be definitely other people involved in that process.
Julia Jones:
Yes. Yes. Yes. No, I love that. I also have a huge desire as well to yeah, make some of those bigger picture systems changes. The course that we're just releasing right now, the new courses, the intention of it is to bring the role of being postpartum, what kind of people know as a doula, but into being a more mainstream evidence-based and allied health kind of a role, and eventually being able to get funding for that, so.
And but I also acknowledge that obviously, my passion is postpartum care, but we need better funding across the board. Midwives right now in WA are all striking and the government's not listening at all. And I just think it's crazy. How do you come through a pandemic and the nurses and midwives say, "We need to get paid better, we need better staff-to-patient ratios."
How can you say no to that? It's insane. So sometimes it feels like things are changing and then sometimes it just feels like there's just still such a long way to go. But the power of the internet is I think that people like you and I can actually grow these audiences and have these conversations and it feels like we can actually make a difference.
Have you observed a shift in public awareness around postpartum care? (26:17)
Sophie Walker:
Yeah. And I feel like there's been, since you and I have both begun then back in this kind of yeah, 2017-ish, there's been a huge shift of just more, there hasn't been the changes we need to see happen, but there's a lot more talk about it.
And there's, yeah, I think postpartum doula seemed very back then would be like, "Oh, so alternative and only for home births" or something like that. But it's now really become mainstream discussion. So I mean, it's exciting to see that. So hopefully in the next, or perhaps not that many years, not another seven years, but to see what happens in the next few years once people are really seeing the importance of this work.
Julia Jones:
I think so, because I think it's changing actually really quickly. Once that change starts, it's kind of like a tipping point. I actually started as a postpartum doula before my daughter was born in 2010. So I was probably studying in about 2008. And when I'd say I'm a doula, people would say, "A jeweller?"
And I was like, "No, a doula." And then they'd, if they knew what a doula was, they'd assume it was for birth. I was like, "No, I've never been to a birth. That's not what I do." It was so hard to get started. And for such a long time I've had to teach people how to become a postpartum care professional in an environment that has no idea what that means.
And actually in this new revision of the course, that's changing a little bit. We don't have to teach people to teach people what the role is and why you need it. It's a bit easier to actually just put a website up there and say, "I'm a postpartum doula" and you might actually get a phone call. So...
Sophie Walker:
Yeah.
Julia Jones:
It's really that's, then I agree, that's really only been in the last three years. I was talking to Amy as well about this from Mama Rising and we were agreeing kind of somewhere around 2019, 2020, 2021, I feel like it's definitely shifting gears.
Sophie Walker:
Yeah. Even seeing matrescence and things used more widely in the kind of new space and stuff in people for a long time. I mean, that still needs work, but it's definitely. People aren't that unfamiliar with it. Yeah.
Julia Jones:
Yeah. I keep noticing. I do a newsletter now once every month or so, that's a read, watch, listen, that is about mainstream television shows or music or podcasts or books that are about regular topics, but have some kind of main character who's going through some sort of postpartum transformation or healing from some kind of birth trauma or whatever it is.
And it is surprising to see how much more that's just kind of becoming a part of all kinds of stories. There doesn't have to be a story about a mother, it can be a story about a mystery or a drama or a comedy, but there's also this character exists now. It's not invisible anymore.
Sophie Walker:
Definitely. Yeah, it's exciting to see how it'll continue to evolve.
Where can people buy The Complete Australian Guide to Pregnancy and Birth? (29:29)
Julia Jones:
Cool. Well, it's been lovely to chat. Do you want to let us know where people can find your book and the podcast and the courses?
Sophie Walker:
Yeah. So I think when this comes out, you'll be able to buy The Complete Australian Guide to Pregnancy and Birth in all good book shops. You can also buy it through my website where you can find all my courses and the podcast at australianbirthstories.com.
Julia Jones:
Is it overseas straight away, or not yet?
Sophie Walker:
They're working on that, but you can buy the eBooks, you should be able to buy the ebook as of today. Yeah.
Julia Jones:
Excellent. Anywhere. That's awesome.
Sophie Walker:
Yeah. Thanks so much for having me. It was so nice to chat.
Julia Jones:
Pleasure. Lovely to chat. And we'll pop all those details in the show notes for everyone and we'll see you all again next time.
